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Welcome to Season 3

• Dr. D. Seles Gadson and Angie Cauthorn • Season 3 • Episode 1

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Hey Brain Friends, Celebrating the life and legacy of Dr. Seles is at the heart of today's episode. I'm sharing the original recording of our neuroplasticity episode from 2022 that didn't make the cut. We had so much fun recording this but when we went to edit, the levels were not good. updates to the platform, there is a fix now. LOL We explore the concept of neuroplasticity and its role in recovery and personal growth, infused with laughter and ice breakers! We had such a good time recording this, I hope you enjoy. I will be back on the mic when I can, right now I'm grieving my friend. So enjoy this gem.

• Reflecting on the impact of Dr. Seles’s life 
• Scholarships established in her name to promote health equity 
• Understanding neuroplasticity and how the brain adapts 
• Engaging in memory recall through an icebreaker 
• Tips for incorporating playful activities to promote brain health 
• The significance of consistency in practice during recovery 
• How art and exercise can aid neuroplasticity 
• The inspiring journeys shared by listeners and community members 

We remind our Brain Friends to support the scholarships established to honor Dr. Seles and I encourage everyone to explore their websites for detailed information.

 
https://aphasia.org/stories/announcing-the-davetrina-seles-gadson-health-equity-grant-program/

https://www.cognitiverecoverylab.com/seles

https://www.cognitiverecoverylab.com/seles

https://aphasia.org/stories/announcing-the-davetrina-seles-gadson-health-equity-grant-program/

Our beloved colleague, Dr. Davetrina Seles Gadson, passed away January 11, 2025. Dr. Gadson was an extraordinary speech-language pathologist and neuroscience researcher who devoted her energy to studying health disparities in aphasia recovery. She was a fierce advocate for improving services for individuals with aphasia, particularly Black Americans. Her research transformed our understanding of these health disparities and shed light on how we can address them. We were privileged to have Dr. Gadson as a cherished member of our lab community for four years, first as a postdoctoral fellow and then as an Instructor of Rehabilitation Medicine. She was still a close collaborator and friend to many of us at the time of her passing. Dr. Gadson was an incredible person—compassionate, inspiring, and full of life. Her dedication to advancing equity in aphasia recovery and her profound impact on our community will never be forgotten. We are committed to honoring her memory by continuing to push our field forward and fight for equitable services for all people with aphasia.

Angie :

Hey Brain Friends. As I step into Season 3 of Brain Friends, I am filled with gratitude for those conversations, for the laughter and for the stories that will remain with me. I met some phenomenal people at the memorial in Augusta, georgia, a few weeks ago. I want to give a shout out to her entire family, of course, my Dukes, my Dukes, her sister Tab, her father, mr Dave, her aunt and uncle and cousins out in Maryland, that Maryland crew, don't play about Celeste, they don't play about celeste, they don't play about their dave trina. So, of course, what up unc? Hey, auntie, she has, uh, the best, best friends, and it was funny because I referred to one of them as her Tae and, as all you guys know, me and Tae, we rock and her Tae, she has two Tay's, she has Itaski and Veronica, and those are her Tae's and them girls bout it bout it, bout it bout it.

Angie :

So I want to give a shout out to them. I just want to say thank you to all of her friends. Chica, I ain't forget you, girl. Um, that really helped me. And they didn't know me. I don't know them, they don't know me, but we all love trina. So, um, in addition, there are going to be. There are not going to be. There are two scholarship awards in her name. One is out of georgetown, it's the dave trina celeste gatson phd scholarship fund through georgetown university supports junior scholars who aim to follow in dr gatson's footsteps and continue her mission to improve equity for stroke survivors.

Angie :

And the other one is the Dave trina Seles Gadson Health Equity Grant Program through the National Aphasia Association, of which I am on the board. Aphasia association, of which I am on the board. It's an initiative designed to support innovative projects that address systemic inequalities in aphasia care and research. Both of these scholarships and programs grants, need our support. Uh, if we don't, who will? So the information to give to the scholarships, uh, will be in the show notes. Show notes, yeah, they'll be in the show notes and will. Um, it's on us to support these important initiatives, the also the information to visit those websites. I I have to say the cognition recovery labcom tribute to her is phenomenal. Um, the one on the naa is also great, but the one with from georgetown, georgetown, has some video.

Angie :

You know you got to love the video, so they have some video from the service actually. So this entire season will be dedicated to Dr Davet rina Seles Gadson echoing her joy, her, her laughter and her spirit, making it a joyful tribute rather than a solemn farewell. I can't, I don't know how to do this and not have it's so hard to say goodbye playing in the background like I really don't know how to do this without doing that. So, honestly, I have been struggling to get back up on this mic. So, to that end, uh, today we're doing a tribute, uh episode and what we're going to do is we're taking it back to the original neuroplasticity, when we did neuroplasticity. You know what I'm going to. Let the episode speak for itself, but the point is we had to re-record it because the levels weren't great. I now have the technology to fix those levels so I can share that episode with you right now. I hope you enjoy.

Angie :

Thank you for being here, thank you for reaching out to the family with your condolences and to me with your condolences. So, on behalf of the Gadson family, my dukes tab quincy hey, quincy. The entire family I thank you. And to her guy Lawrence he is a man amongst men, their brother stepped all the way up and through. So shout out to you, sir, I just want to thank everyone for just opening their arms, uh, to me, uh, because I didn't know anybody, but everybody knew me and treated me like family. So I thank you for that and um, um, anyway, welcome back to brain friends, or, better yet, welcome to Brain Friends. Let's get it.

Dr Seles:

Hey.

Angie :

Angie. Hey Dr Seles, how are you?

Dr Seles:

I'm doing well. How are you?

Angie :

you know what I am feeling? Fine, but a little, um, what's the word I want to use? A little, uh, shunned, I'm gonna go with. Shunned, I'm gonna go with straight shunned. I look, I was on Instagram on your page and I saw that you had a full page, like four page write up in like the Asha magazine. Well, I got to find this online. Why don't you call me?

Dr Seles:

Oh, you know. So, the Asha magazine. They actually did that a while ago. They did that, I think, last year, in conjunction with the ASHA conference, where we talked about health disparities. Yeah, but I do have some good news that I don't know if you saw what's that, which is part of my disclaimer for today's. My performance in today's episode is that I was celebrating because our manuscript got published. What? Yes, the Journal of Communication Disorders, aphasia Severity is Modulated by Race and Lesion Size in chronic stroke survivors a retrospective study.

Angie :

That is amazing. I am super proud. I'm so proud of you. That is awesome. So when do you present this? Like, how does that work? The process to present any of that?

Dr Seles:

Oh yeah, so I am going to, I'll actually be speaking at the ASHA conference 2022. And so I'll touch a little bit about it there and then you know, I think by the time this airs, we might have already had your aphasia. Awareness fair, your aphasia awareness fair, but I'm going to talk a little bit about it there too.

Angie :

And yeah, I just really want to get the word out. Oh, that is absolutely fabulous. So is it? Where can I read it? Is it on your Instagram Like where? Yeah, definitely.

Dr Seles:

Where can you find it? Yeah, so it's on my website, wwwdeselesscom. That's where you can find all information about the things that I'm doing, including publications and brain friends. But, honey, I'll send you the email with my special link yes, I need the special link.

Angie :

I need that show notes let our people. See, you are doing great things.

Dr Seles:

That is absolutely fabulous.

Angie :

Listen, let me ask you a question because we're going to jump into the episode, but I had to check you. Such an inspiration and I'm just so proud to be doing this with you.

Angie :

So listen, I have a question. I saw a meme and I know you can't go by what you see on a meme, so don't don't come for me, right? But the meme said that if you have brain damage, you will always have like that part of the brain is dead. It might not that is not going to come back online but what you do get is to be able to kind of go around that dead area, but the part that's dead is dead. Is that true?

Dr Seles:

Yeah, dead, is that true? Yeah, so oftentimes what happens with a stroke is that those pieces that were damaged by the stroke are dead. And one of the things that therapy does, as well as one of the things that makes our brain so amazing, is that the brain will build new connections and find out a different way to go, since it can't access that information through the regular route because those neurons are now dead. So that's true, but the brain will build new ones.

Angie :

Okay. So it's kind of like the analogy I used to like to give when I um, when I first had my stroke. I asked my neurologist, I I said it's like I'm, I feel like it's like I'm driving to my grandmom's house and when I get there the house is gone. There's no houses around it, it's just a little piece of the playground that was across the street and it's just gone. But I feel like I'm where I'm supposed to be in my head, but like my grandma's house has just been leveled and I couldn't, I am messing up my own analogy.

Angie :

The point is let me back up. Let me back up the analogy is I'm driving to grandmom's and when I get there the house is gone. And what I asked my neurologist is is the house gone or is my GPS just taking me to the wrong place? And she says, no, your GPS is taking you to the right place, grandma's house is just gone. And with that I said, okay, good enough, I have to rebuild it and I have to build that. And I had to kind of get on with the business of intentionally rewiring and trying to relearn what I had. And what she said was what I was describing was neuroplasticity and that is the relearning and the rewiring of information.

Dr Seles:

Yeah, exactly, Because the brain will rewire itself to function in the same way but differently, if that makes sense. And you know, one of the things that's awesome about our brain is that it is adaptable like plastic. And when we think about neuroplasticity, it's activity driven, and so frequently used pathways are strengthened, whereas, you know, the pathways that you don't use are weakened. So it goes back to that saying of use it or lose it.

Angie :

Mm, hmm, mm, hmm, mm, hmm.

Dr Seles:

So there are ways to help build that neuroplasticity, inform new connections, given that the old connections are either weakened or dead because of damage we got to get back into it, but we got to do our um uh icebreakers. Oh, this icebreaker this time. Look, let me. I already gave my disclaimer, but um so we're going to do uh recall refresh the disclaimer Like so we're going to do delayed memory recall and um let the record show that we'll see how delayed okay, okay, okay.

Dr Seles:

So delayed memory recall is where I'll give you three words, you'll give me three words and then we'll go on with our conversation and after so long we'll have to repeat those words. Do you want to do five minutes or 10 minutes?

Angie :

Let's do five minutes, okay, and I actually have a timer. All right, Because you know, okay, come on prepare, all right. So what are, um, uh, what are your three words for me?

Dr Seles:

okay, your three words are light, pillow, kermit.

Angie :

Light, kermit, kermit, kermit and what?

Dr Seles:

Light pillow Kermit.

Angie :

Okay, your three words are pillow camera house.

Dr Seles:

Okay, pillow camera house.

Angie :

Pillow camera house. Yep, okay, all right. So I have another question. I already asked you kind of what is neuroplasticity and how does it work, but how can people with aphasia use neuroplasticity to improve their communication?

Dr Seles:

Yeah, that's a great question. So I think people with aphasia can improve their communication using neuroplasticity, by targeting things in your thinking, your actions and your routine. And what I mean by that is, you know, the more you do new things, the more connections are built, and so, rather, it's establishing a routine to even start that process. So, you know, some people are like, oh, I don't really have a routine, I just go with the flow, right? Um, that's fine.

Dr Seles:

But when you're trying to build new habits or new connections, then it goes back to that use it or lose it framework, and so you have to be doing something to create that repetitive and that repetition piece. So, if you think about your brain as a muscle, the only thing that can help build muscle is actually lifting weights and doing those types of activities to build that muscle, and so that's one way is, through your actions and your routine, making sure that you're doing things that are actually like making your brain think. So a lot of people sometimes watch a lot of television, and the thing about television is that not only is it a sedentary activity, but you're not, your brain's not doing really anything, it's just there.

Angie :

And so those just kind of washing over you.

Dr Seles:

Exactly, and so activities like that aren't going to be the best in helping to create those new neural pathways, because, legit, you're not doing nothing see, this is the after I've been out on a night because you ain't doing nothing. Uh, we're celebrating that we were just published, so so, pardon the realness because, legit, you're not trying.

Angie :

No, but I think, yeah, I tried to stay as actively. That's why I kind of involved myself in research as well, because I wanted to just keep doing something that would be helpful after therapy, because by the time I got out of therapy it wasn't I didn't really find I found therapy not to be that great of um. I didn't get my greatest gains there. Um, it was definitely after the fact, and I'm sure the foundation was set in therapy. So I'm not saying like it was a waste of time, but I wasn't seeing any gains then, because the gains are slow, steady and silent.

Dr Seles:

Oh, that part. Because the other thing too, angie, is that neuroplastic changes happen all the time, but the magnitude depends on how much activity the brain receives. So again, the more practice leads to more learning, and it's not limited in age. And so you know, with therapy you were having some of those changes, but participating in research and using your brain in a different way is going to help create stronger connections.

Angie :

Like editing a podcast. Look, okay, Come on editor.

Dr Seles:

Yes, come on, editor Exactly. Yes, come on, come on, editor Exactly. Because even in that, like you know, the world needs to know that not only do you edit the podcast, but you will send me suggestions to help me do my part, because what we not going to do, look, and so I think that, even in that, like, you're really strengthening your brain because you're exposing your brain to these new things and, um, you know, one of the one of the things about neuroplasticity also is that that repeated and directed attention toward a thing can also help rewire that activity. And so the point that you are reading and learning new things within the podcast and editing that's like not only using a different part of your brain, but also strengthening and rewiring it as well.

Angie :

Wow, and you had said something earlier about almost like it. When you're saying the brain is a muscle, you had said something earlier about almost like it. When you're saying the brain is a muscle, is it helpful to do these things? And like you know, let's say I'm doing, you know, is it with working out, like, if I use that type of Monday, wednesday, friday, is the? Do you think the consistency matters?

Dr Seles:

Oh yeah, the consistency definitely matters again, because you're strengthening and you're building a new way you think about it, how, if you're traveling somewhere for the first time, you might have to use a GPS the first time, but the more you go that route, the more your brain is going to remember and say, oh okay, well, no, now I do this, and that's one of the things. Another tip that I strongly suggest, if you're just looking at your brain and aging, is that you know, turn off that GPS sometimes, because when you're using the GPS all the time, even after you kind of have gone that way a little bit, it's good to allow your brain, that exercise and that practice to actually try to remember.

Angie :

And navigate, and navigate.

Dr Seles:

And navigate it Exactly.

Angie :

Yeah, I think those type of things where you had to. You know, back in the day you had to get the directions from the guy at the rest stop and he's like, all right, six lights make a left, then a right, you're going to see this sign and then you know straight down and you know, and so it was like eight different steps. Then we got MapQuest, now we got Google quest, now we got google. We don't need to know. Now I don't have to talk to nobody about nothing. See, but that's taken away from what? The brain power, or the brain, uh, muscle. Oh, look at us five minutes okay, okay.

Angie :

um, this is embarrassing. Yeah, I'm going to need a. Can I get a clue?

Dr Seles:

Can I phone a friend? Let me go first with mine because it might trigger one of yours.

Angie :

Okay, go ahead. See Look, I just popped out like let me go first and I was like okay, what?

Dr Seles:

were they um?

Angie :

it was pillow camera house yes, okay, I have absolutely no idea. They were simple words.

Dr Seles:

Yeah, we had one word in common.

Angie :

Did we? Mm-hmm, I gave you one of your words back. Yeah, see, that should have told you right there.

Dr Seles:

I thought you were making it easy for me.

Angie :

No, you need to read the room and recognize I had forgotten immediately. So was it all right? Well, maybe I can do that Was one of your words. Pillow? Yes, Okay, well, which is why that's very telling. So, yeah, I have I. Yeah, I didn't. I didn't give you pillow because that was one of my.

Angie :

I didn't even know and so I had actually forgotten immediately, which is not, uh, not funny. But wow, and I was trying, you know, I tried at least hold one or two of them, but but I did because I said pillow, so I gave that right back to you. Know, I tried to at least hold one or two of them, but but I did because I said pillow, so I gave that right back to you, which was a clue to me. Yeah, that's a win, that's a win, so that's one. I got one out of two, one out of two, and that's what we're doing.

Dr Seles:

So sometimes with the delayed memory recall type task, we'll use a strategy to where we either visualize it or link them together. The words somehow in our mind Did you use?

Angie :

any of those strategies? Is that helping? I did a lot of memory recall at Temple and that they would have me and what I would do is put the word in a sentence and then try to remember the sentence and then pull the words from there. But I was not able to or I didn't do that. Like that, just my, my only trick that I have I failed to implement. Okay.

Dr Seles:

I didn't have a sentence. You want me to give you a clue, or you just want me to tell you what they are?

Angie :

Yeah, I'm going to be honest with you. I'll take the clue because you know I'll take the clue, but I'm not.

Dr Seles:

So one clue is it's the opposite of dark Light, mm-hmm.

Angie :

Yeah, that doesn't even sound familiar, so it was light pillow, pillow.

Dr Seles:

Oh you waiting for me to jump in.

Angie :

I'm looking at you like, and Fog Kermit. Kermit. Oh God Dang, go on. I repeated Kermit twice because I didn't hear you say it right? Oh, that's it. Yeah, that was not even on the, that wasn't even on the horizon, that wasn't even in the room. Yeah, it goes pretty quick. That memory recall is so not my, I mean, but I am getting better and it's not as prevalent as it seems. You're showing me a picture of Kermit and I'm like green, green frog. Is that what I said? I said see frog.

Dr Seles:

Yeah, but that's okay. I didn't even think, you know, I didn't even think. Well, if it means anything, I didn't even think to say frog, I thought Kermit, the actual frog's name.

Angie :

Yeah, which is what you gave me. I mean, it's not Right. This ain't a thousand word pyramid. I'm supposed to come up with the real word. You gave me a word. I'm supposed to repeat the word.

Dr Seles:

Right, it's not. You were out celebrating with me.

Angie :

Yes, I went and saw For the record, For the record In spirit, we went to the football game in Friday Night Lights in Morristown. We went and saw our high school team play. My husband and I, we do that on Friday nights. We go to Chick-fil-A, eat in the car and then go to the game and then we come home. So that was.

Dr Seles:

So that's okay. So that's the thing with the three words. But I think one of the things that you mentioned that is great is that you do have a strategy and, yeah, sometimes you remember them, sometimes you don't.

Angie :

I'm in Joy's Got Nuts and Mounds, don't? It is what it is.

Dr Seles:

That's the neuroplasticity of the brain, wow.

Angie :

And so the things that you just all of a sudden didn't know, like when you get to your. It's all about the new roots that you create, though, because even though, um, you know, if I go back to the grandmom GPS analogy, you know you can, um, I'm on my way, but then I get lost midway and it's how do you get the new roots? Because it's kind of like, you know, things have been washed away. That train of thought, that pathway is gone. It's so now, with neuroplasticity, my brain is rewiring itself and making new pathways to get me to the same information.

Angie :

That process, to me, is absolutely mind blowing, because the brain is just so fascinating. But when you're creating the new pathways, is it going to take more energy from me, as the person with brain damage, to continue to function? What I'm saying is like am I going to be extra tired because I have this new pathway? I can't go the original route, but I have this pathway to get me to the same information. Is that going to take more energy for me to get there? Does that make sense?

Dr Seles:

Yeah, I think that everybody is different and I think that that is a great question, for I do think that everyone is different and I think that that's a great question for, like your medical provider. But you know, one thing that you do have to understand is, like, oftentimes, people with brain injury or after a stroke report feeling fatigue, are feeling tired because that could be, you know, when you're sleeping and you're resting, that's your brain's opportunity to help, um, um kind of consolidate those new pathways and memory. That's like when your brain is doing its work. You know it's learned all these things, things that's been active all day, and so now it's tired and when you have a stroke you're exhausted all the time Like you can knock out of a quick 14, 16 hour sleep session easily.

Angie :

But when you look at neuroplasticity, is there anything that a person can do specific? Is there anything that a person can do specific? Is there anything that people with aphasia can do to increase their neuroplasticity? Like to help build those new roots?

Dr Seles:

Yeah, so there there are a couple of things. You know. The biggest thing is to keep the brain busy, keep it healthy, and when I say busy, I'm not saying be a busy body, look let me differentiate that you just doing stuff to do stuff.

Dr Seles:

I'm not saying that just liking everybody's posts like right I'm saying you want to do things that are actively requiring, requiring your brain to think through things. So, rather, even if it's something like a word search or a word puzzle or a puzzle or just anything that's really requiring your brain to do something, if it's something that you used to do very frequently, like, maybe, cook and now you're having a hard time cooking, maybe look at a recipe, even if it's you know a recipe that you know you follow before, it might be helpful to to do something like that that can keep the brain busy and help. Exercise, of course, is something that research has shown to improve, and one of the exercises that I like a lot, especially with brain recovery, is cross crawl exercises.

Angie :

What is that?

Dr Seles:

Yeah, so cross crawl exercises integrate both hemispheres and strengthening network the communication of the corpus callosum, and so basically it's like if you bring your right arm to your left leg and so think about like exercises, like either bicycles or anytime you're, you're making your right side of the body crossover your left side, because you know the brain is contralateral and so oftentimes you know, especially with people with aphasia, they might have that left hemisphere brain damage, but physically lateral mean so contralateral is that the brain integrates the opposite side of the body and so innervates the opposite side of the body.

Dr Seles:

And so you know, if someone has left side brain damage, they might physically see that manifest on their right side, and vice versa, If they have a right sided head injury, they might physically see the manifestation, so numbness or weakness on the left side.

Angie :

Right Like so my right hand began to close up the night of my stroke. That's because the stroke was on my left side of my brain. Exactly, and that's also where the communication is held.

Dr Seles:

Right, and so those cross crawl exercises. It crosses that communication because you're bringing one side of your body to the other side.

Angie :

So are there like things we can do?

Dr Seles:

Yeah, ok, so I do have a couple of neuroplasticity brain exercises. Exercises For us to do that. I looked up and I'll put these in the show notes.

Angie :

Okay, you ready? Yes, Okay.

Dr Seles:

So the first one is to draw a circle in the air with your left hand. Okay, and draw a triangle with your right hand. Oh, that's that.

Angie :

Are you actually doing it? You know you ain't right. Okay, I I'm about to poke myself in the eye okay, I, I can't, I'm that was.

Dr Seles:

That was tough, yeah, so that was a little challenging, but you see how you're doing I start making rectangles for both. Like, Like yeah, okay, I have another one. All right, make two fists with the hands facing you, okay. Extend your left thumb, all right, and your right pinky. Yes, I'm sorry, okay, okay. So you have your two fists with your hands facing you. Extend your left thumb and your right pinky to the left Left thumb, right pinky to the left. Switch back and forth.

Angie :

Oh, no yeah.

Dr Seles:

I don't have that one either. I'm going to blame that one on celebration. Okay, yeah, I don't have that one either.

Angie :

I'm gonna blame that one on celebration. Okay, yeah, I don't. Yeah, I'm listen, angie's about to lose her eye, so let's not, I can't, but that is, that's good stuff. And yeah, those type of um exercises are so key. I didn't know I couldn't touch my thumb to my fingers until the neurologist asked me to do it. You know, I remember it was like, oh wow, I didn't know that that was for me. It was the things that I would lose, that I didn't know were up for grabs, like I didn't know I could lose that.

Dr Seles:

Right.

Angie :

Even with language. I didn't know that I could lose the ability to do that, and so I could lose the ability to do that, and so yeah that was the thing for me.

Dr Seles:

But yeah, that is good stuff. Yeah, the other thing, too, that we definitely need more science on, but have shown to be effective in helping people with aphasia increase neuroplasticity, is things like art and extra well, I said exercise already, but things like art and music. One of the things behind that is that art and music is like on the right side of the brain, where you know, like the left side of the brain is our language. Those types of things usually reside in the right side, and so the question is if those are stronger in that area because the right side of the brain hasn't been influenced by the stroke that maybe that can strengthen some of the left side types of activities. For an example, if you're really big in art and drawing and things like that, maybe that can support language activity, and again, the research hasn't confirmed this to massive extents.

Dr Seles:

Okay right, right Don't come, but Right Don't come for me. But you know, I do think that there has to be something to it.

Angie :

Right, right, absolutely, absolutely, um yeah, absolutely. It's early in the morning, I can't I got. These words are rushing over me. I'm not even going to hold you.

Dr Seles:

What do you mean? The words are rushing over you. It's when I don't pick up what you're saying. Okay, okay what I just said. Yeah, okay, no what I just said yeah, okay.

Angie :

No, I'm saying first of all, I'm saying as a whole like the thing with the words, like I usually I shouldn't be able to give you one or two of them back, but there's times where words just literally rush over me and I don't I'm not picking any of them up. I consider it to be like it's like holding up a red cup at a fire hydrant. You know what I mean like it's too much. It's just too much force or yeah, yes at a fire hydrant.

Angie :

You know what I mean. Like it's just, the hose is too much. I have the cup, but there's nothing getting in the cup. That's you know. Another great analogy from your girl what?

Dr Seles:

yeah, yeah, well, I think the thing about neuroplasticity and it's one of the things that I'm even I mean it goes to show that when you have brain fog, or you've been out the night before and then you get up the next morning, how your brain is still recovering. No, but I mean I can't, I couldn't find another word, but um rebooting rebooting, yes, the brain is still establishing with the collective right rebooting. So all of that to say. I understand what you're right.

Angie :

What judgment?

Dr Seles:

right what you're saying and, of course, no judgment, but but what I was saying about the, the thing I just said with the um neuroplasticity piece and things that can help to increase the neuroplasticity with the, with the art right, um, what I'm basically trying to say with that is that the more people do things that either they enjoy or that are new to them, the more plasticity, um, the more they put themselves at a better position to increase plasticity. Rather, it's learning art, rather it's learning a new song, whatever it is that's new to you and can support you.

Angie :

Actually using your brain, even if it's the creative side of your brain, can help build neurons okay and connections I do have to say and people laugh at me all the time because you know, I played my basketball game online or the xbox, but it were. It helped me so much with my hand and eye coordination. You got to build, you got to build a dude to play basketball for you, and they give you down to the hair follicles. Is he bald? Do he have braids? Is he wearing red?

Angie :

It's a whole thing, but and a couple of times I just it was at first I really couldn't even do it, but it's just a matter of being able to do things that are hard and then stay with it, and that's the thing, like I like doing it, and so I just stayed at it, even when it wasn't going well. And I think sometimes people it doesn't go well, they get discouraged and they leave, and I get that too, and I get that too. I get that too. I'm not going to sit here and act like I don't know how that feels, because I do, but I think I just want to encourage people to continue to try and continue to push forward, because the only way you can't control the wind, you can only adjust your sails. You must adjust.

Dr Seles:

You can't control the wind. You can only adjust your sails. Yeah, I like that Come on sails, come on sails, come on wind. No, I think that's beautiful and you know we're we're out of time, but I think that you said something that's so important is that, even though it was challenging, you stuck with it, and the thing, if any message I can give, it would be find something that you can be consistent at and that you can stick with with, because that's what's going to help create some of those new networks and get you stronger, and so that's the biggest thing thing. But then they fall off and then that creates, you know, its own set of mental health pieces of oh, I didn't do it, but you kind of set yourself up so failure find something that you can be consistent at.

Dr Seles:

I think it's a great start all right, well, I'm just gonna.

Angie :

I have to tell you my quick story and I'm gonna let you go. Who's to say? But I went when I first had my stroke. Rosetta Stone was on sale and so I brought it and I'm like I'll learn. You know, I'm going to get new pathways. I'm going to learn Spanish. Ok, I don't, I have, I don't listen, I don't know any more Spanish than I did from 11th grade Spanish. Wow, it was so. Even opening the package was like overwhelming and I I didn't get to step one. Um, and to this day I still have it and I totally own the thing. But I just couldn't. It was just that was that's too much for what I could do, so I had to ramp it down a bit, yeah, but anyway, I just wanted to share that with you. Thank you, guys for listening, downloading and staying with us. We are the Brain Friends, brain Friends, brain Friends. Alright, guys, bye, peace y'all.

Dr Seles:

We hope you enjoyed this episode of Brain Friends. Please leave us a five-star review on Apple Podcasts or your favorite streaming platform. Also, make sure you subscribe to our YouTube channel.

Angie :

Brain Friends. The podcast. I'm so extra. Carry on.